Quantum redactiones paginae "Disputatio:Tribunal internationale Hagense" differant
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::::Indeed yes, Cicero would think "less" of "sex nationes" (six nations/tribes from outside the empire) versus "sex gentes" (six clans/races from within the empire), "sex civitates" (six citizenships; he would have trouble understanding this as "six states"), and sex res publicas ( six types or generations of government; again would have trouble understanding this since there was only one republic at a time). But what he or Caesar "felt" about them status-wise is beside the point. The point is what they are '''existentially'''.--[[Usor:Rafaelgarcia|Rafaelgarcia]] 20:08, 26 Iulii 2009 (UTC)
:::::De: "Hispania, Gallia, et Britannia are among those nationes thought so lowly of, but are obviously what we call nations today."—Were they really considered ''nationes'' in Classical times? ''Germania'' clearly wasn't, at least by Tacitus, as we see in this passage: "''nunc singularum '''gentium''' instituta ritusque, quatenus differant, quaeque '''nationes''' e '''Germania''' in Gallias commigraverunt, expediam'' 'I shall now set forth the habits and customs of the several '''races,''' and the extent to which they differ from each other; and explain what '''tribes''' have migrated from '''Germany''' to the Gallic provinces'" (''Germania,'' 27, in the Loeb edition). [[Usor:IacobusAmor|IacobusAmor]] 22:01, 26 Iulii 2009 (UTC)
::::::Indeed Gens was used as a polite term for natio very often. Strictly speakig however, nationes were people outside the empire; gentes were people inside; and nationes naturally became gentes as they became integrated. So Germans, Spaniards, etc., as they became citizens were no longer considered nationes, at least not unless you wanted to insult them. Since within the empire, the gens was considered the general term for a distinct civilized people, there was "ius gentium" that governed the legal relations among non-citizens within the empire. IF a non citizen committed a crime against another noncitizen he was subject to the ius gentium, not the ius civile. Thus, today (by extension) we have "ius gentium"= international law, considered to be the law that binds all peoples not just within the empire but everywhere. --[[Usor:Rafaelgarcia|Rafaelgarcia]] 22:22, 26 Iulii 2009 (UTC)
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